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for the american economy. >> an added wrinkle to the fiscal cliff talks is the debt ceiling, with the government on pace to reach its borrowing limit early next year. the white house stated its position on the 14th amendment, which some theory rise is a way for the president to raise the debt limit independently, should republicans attempt to use it as a negotiating tool. >> i can say that this administration does not believe that the 14th amendment gives the president the power to ignore the debt ceiling, period. >> the fiscal cliff talks reached a new low yesterday when, somehow, the new york jets got dragged into it on the senate floor. >> it's not one of my favorite teams, but it's really, really fun to watch, and that's the new york jets. coach ryan, he's got a problem. he has three quarterbacks, sanchez, he's got tim tebow, he's got another guy. he can't decide who their quarterback is going to be. that's the same problem republicans are having. romney's gone, but he's still in the background. we have mcconnell and we have boehner. who is the quarterback, mr. president? who is the quarterb
of this and negotiate on the debt ceiling. two questions, one, will any agreement come out for the fiscal cliff leave the debt ceiling unresolved, and, two, what would you even negotiate on the debt ceiling, should that be something that republicans force your hand on? are you with the president who says we need to kick them of that habit and never negotiate on raising the debt ceiling again? >> i think the president is right. the debt ceiling ought not to be a negotiable item. i don't know of anyone who agrees not putting america's credit worthiness at risk, saying to the world that america has incurred debt but is not going to pay them, is an alternative. i don't think that's -- i think senator mcconnell doesn't believe that, senator reid doesn't believe it, congresswoman pelosi doesn't agree, i don't agree, the majority leader doesn't agree with that. this ought not to be an item of negotiations or a leverage item, as i would hope speaker boehner would take that off the table as some sort of leverage item. what the president has suggested, take senator mcconnell's suggestion. the president would s
wants to take the debt ceiling issue out of discussions about the fiscal cliff. take a listen. >> if congress in any way suggests they're going to tie negotiations to debt ceiling votes and take us to the brink of default once again as part of a budget negotiation, i will not play that game. >> congressman, the last time republicans used the debt ceiling for political purposes, the full faith and credit of this nation was downgraded. are they really happy, really happy, in the face of what you've just heard the president say, are they happy to do if again? >> yeah, they have acted irresponsibly. many house republicans have acted like children. they have behaved like children. when children behave containing yously, you take the dangerous toy as way from them. they want to continue on a three-month basis. they have tried to schett down the federal government on a three-month timetable because they don't fundamentally believe the government should help grow the middle class or help small businesses retire people, retain employees, or helping veterans. so we don't think it's a g
of a union fight. i have a former governor of michigan here. plus, we'll talk fiscal cliff and debt ceiling with him. plus, one hatch of simpson-bowles. the erskine bowles half. the less dancing of the duo. why former chief of staff is growing more optimistic we'll be able to get a deal before the cliff dive. by the way, will he take a job in president obama's cabinet? i'll have that answer straight ahead. first, a look ahead at the president's schedule today. you can see it's michigan with the lunch time remarks. back to the white house before 5:00. [ male announcer ] when ziggy the cat appeared at their door, he opened up jake's very private world. at first, jake's family thought they saved ziggy, but his connection with jake has been a lifesaver. for a love this strong, his family only feeds him iams. compared to other leading brands, it has 50% more animal protein... ...to help keep ziggy's body as strong as a love that reaches further than anyone's words. iams. keep love strong. ♪ don't know what i'd do ♪ i'd have nothing to prove ♪ i'd have nothing to lose [ male announcer ] zal
will be on this massive, $60.3 trillion debt, this fiscal cliff. but, most importantly, this debt crisis next year. i'm not talking about what's going to happen in february or january. what i want to talk about is how do we solve this problem? how do we get the speaker? and the president actually opened up that back door. they're sitting there making back room deals. open up and let the american people see what's going on. i want to see what's going on. they won't tell either side what the deal-making is going on. i don't think that's the way to make policy. >> now, as you said, you and i may not agree. we've debated on this show, though you've always come on. are you saying that you believe that speaker boehner has a score card and is punishing you and three others for standing up and voting for what you believe to be right? >> that is apparently the case. we wrote a letter to the speaker and i think if you read the language of the letter, you walk through all of the washington and you see oh, yes, there was a score card and we were graded a certain way, graded down because we wanted to balance the
if you think the fiscal cliff is fun, you'll love the debt ceiling. the economic havoc that is wreaked by the fiscal cliff is a very gradual thing, as you and have i discussed. going over it is a mistake. we shouldn't do it. but at least initially, if we can reverse it, it won't be so bad. if you default on the nation's debt on our treasury bills, that's not a fiscal slope. that's a cataclysmic economic event. not only are you stiffing creditors who believe they have invested in the safest debt in the universe, you're actually threatening to have to raise our interest rates through the roof in order to service our debt, which means absolutely a long-term recession. it's really quite a fatal step. >> "the wall street journal's" reporting that the white house is willing to do corporate tax reform in their new proposal. what do you think than in what do you think that might mean? >> i think it's a neat idea. the white house is actually articulated a fairly detailed corporate tax idea in a white paper that didn't get enough attention a few years ago. and it's very much in the spirit of thi
fight over the debt ceiling as well. the fiscal cliff and the debt ceiling, are they connected? >> the white house wants them to be connected. they actually think if neck get a deal decoupling the bush tax cuts, having entitlement reform in dealing with the debt ceiling that is getting a raise and not having to worry about it for another couple of years, that's what they want. house republicans have indicated that, look, they actually might want it to kick the can down the road, make a deal on taxes but kick it down the road where they have more leverage. president obama was asked about that earlier this week and said he doesn't want to play the debt ceiling game anymore. that's where republicans have more leverage than then do on other matters. >> all right. senior political editor mark murray, have a great weekend, sir. >> i want to bring in congressman peter welch from vermont. good to see you again. talked to you last weekend on msnbc. at that point you told me that you thought there was a 50/50 shot we'd go off the so-called fiscal cliff. today speaker boehner said talks w
the pieces coming together on the fiscal cliff some increase in marginal tax rates coupled with some kind of cutting back on tax expenditures. the real concern is shifting or will shift from the fiscal cliff to the debt limit. it's not clear that the republicans will agree to including a debt limit increase in that kind of package and if they don't, we may get past december 31st only to find ourselves with a big problem in february or march. >> the obama administration has been clear they will not sign anything. even to get past december 31st. so do you think they can hold firm on that if republicans offer them a package that doesn't include the debt ceiling? >> this is where i think the tension is now arising, which is even if you have some agreement over the tax rates which will jam the republicans a bit, can you jam them on the debt limit also, the concern will be an administration overstepping or overream reaching and trying to jam in the kinds being discussed now. i'm all in favor of getting rid of the debt limit. it makes no sense from a technical perspective. but it's probably a br
, quite frankly happen. now we're talking about using the fiscal cliff or the debt ceiling as the ultimate weapon, trying to get something from the president now or give something to the president now with a threat that the debt ceiling will be used as the weapon in a few weeks or months. and quite frankly, that's no way to run a country. we need to move beyond this stalemate and this gridlock and both parties need to come together. i think the president's trying his best and, quite frankly, i would say that speaker boehner is really trying here. but these are difficult circumstances and i believe -- i return to what i said earlier. we had an election. the president won. when it comes to these tax matters, the people of this country are supportive of the president's approach. >> i'm curious, chip, and you were on this teleconference and obviously those are people very involved and very interested but there's an awful lot of fatigue, election fatigue in this country and, frankly, the holidays -- holiday season is upon us, people are busy, kids are back in school, so son and so forth. how mu
? >> on the fiscal cliff or the debt ceiling? >> on the debt ceiling. >> i was very interested by your reporting. that you took a really strong position there. i do think the white house has been transformed. both by the experience with the debt ceiling and with the election. i think if they want to stand their ground, i think they can actually do it. i think that that is, in fact, possible. can they? you know, we'll see. they seem a lot tougher now than they were last time around. don't you think? >> they sound very tough now. chrystia freeland of thomson, and author of "the plutocrats." >>> i promised, red lobster, olive garden, timely for both, and i will deliver. that is ahead. ♪ ♪ [ male announcer ] the mercedes-benz winter event is back, with the perfect vehicle that's just right for you, no matter which list you're on. [ santa ] ho, ho, ho, ho! [ male announcer ] lease a 2013 c250 for $349 a month at your local mercedes-benz dealer. and his new boss told him two things -- cook what you love, and save your money. joe doesn't know it yet, but he'll work his way up from busser to waiter
, use the tools to sign up people for the can kicks back campaign to avoid the fiscal cliff and cut the national debt. the 81-year-old simpson went "gangnam style" to make his point. ♪ >> i have a bum knee. horse, horse. ride the horse. >> senator, thank you for that. and that's your morning dish of "scrambled politics." and now for a look at your national weather, let's turn to bill karins. he has your weather channel forecast. >> the best part is the underwater robot for a place that doesn't have water. >> maybe it's a pool. >> yes. >> and they need to inspect it. >> counter-terrorism measures in the backyard. you never know. good morning, everyone. getting out the door this morning, it's very cold up in new england. tell you what, the lack of snow is really becoming a slightly alarming especially if you have any interest in snowy weather recreation or skiing or ice skating or maybe you like to go snowmobiling. the northern half of the country is sparse. 7% of the country has snow cover. most of that is the high elevations in the rockies and northern rockies. it's about as low a
in the debt ceiling debate or the fiscal cliff negotiations that neither side will give and they're both being unreasonable. and really not drilling down. the other thing they do is they really go back to newt gingrich and grover norquist. as you've talked about both these things, changing the culture of washington and making compromise impossible. >> here's something really naughty, i think in terms of policy. who can forget back in august not a million years ago when the romney pollster neil newhow said the following. we're not going to let our campaign be kick a at a timed by fact checkers. think about that. fact checkers meaning facts. >> right. >> i was on the show with you the other night. we talked about the quotes of the year. 47%. >> that's a good one. >> i thought this should be the top two of three. that showed their view towards reality. it was an arrogance that we can say whatever we want to say. and i think in years past, this is what's changed. campaigns would not be so brazen. if caught in a lie they maybe feel some shame. here's neil newhouse telling reporters that we don't ca
on the economy. white house wants at the very least a long-term extension of the debt ceiling in any fiscal cliff deal. the republicans now see the debt ceiling as their own leverage. they're demanding a steep price to include it. who anyways if obama will ultimately go along with something like this. but it is a talk that there is still one crucial way he's at the mercy of republicans. it leaves him with a tough choice. to pay their price in entitlements or play debt ceiling chicken with them again. okay. does it for "the cycle" today.
a plan not just to avert the fiscal cliff, but importantly to really tackle the deficit and debt problems in this country. i am concerned that deal won't be big enough. is it going to be small or medium or big. we need a plan big enough to fix the deficit problems and make sure the debt is no longer growing faster than the economy. we're not going to be able to balance the budget in the near future because the fiscal hole is so big. you want to make sure the debt is not growing faster than the economy. that's going to take $4 trillion in savings. you need all parts on the table and constructed in a thoughtful way so that revenues are raised in ways that are good for the economy as possible, and that when we're looking at the spending in the budget, we reform our entitlement programs and reduce spending in way that's thoughtful and good for the economy. it's going to take a lot to get there, but i actually think most of the policy ideas are well known and we're now in this political negotiation where i think there's a lot of support for having them, if they're going to go through all this,
. >> thanks so much. >>> last night he describes what he says is to use the debt creel as a pawn in the fiscal cliff negotiations. >> they see the handwriting on the wall and they're going to have to extend it, and if they don't the whole country will see they were willing to tank the entire economy and give everybody the tax break to give people at the top a bonus. where they're just dead wrong, ed, is thinking they're going to gain leverage over this debt ceiling because the american people are not going to stand for republicans turning right around and threatening to destroy the american economy by having the united states default on its debts. >> don't miss "the ed show" 8:00 p.m. eastern time. >>> there are new details about the stunning military operation and the u.s. navy s.e.a.l. who heroically gave his life to help save a doctor kidnapped by the taliban. nbc's jim has the story. >>> he was a highly decorated navy veteran killed sunday in afghanistan. the s.e.a.l.s set out to rescue an american relief worker dr. dilip joseph kidnapped last week on the road east of kabul. joseph was hel
of a p perpetual fiscal cliff and using the debt ceiling to force concessions. they, you know, used cliche they kicked the can down the road to the super committee and that blew up and now this and talk of a two-prong solution and then dealing with entitlements next year. it does seem like we just keep making, you know, small incremental decisions and then putting off somethingç bigger r six months, a year, 18 months. when will the insanity stop on this? >> yeah. i mean, the thing is -- >> 300 calories! >> stop the insanity! >> that was -- that was susan powter. i knew we talked about it before the show and didn't know we would play it. when will we listen and stop the insanity? feel free to answer. >> yeah. look. you know, it's a real dynamic in place where it takes the horrible things to happen, a risk of a recession, of a debt ceiling, you know, defaulting on u.s. debt, it takes the really dramatic things to force action but it gets back to the issue of where are the power levers and the forcing mechanisms to make the government deal with the deficit? that's not coming from the
% now and therefore avoid the fiscal cliff and put off for now the top 2%. and the question then, let the debt ceiling not take effect. a tax cut delayed i argue is a tax cut avoided. joining me with the republican defense highly tauted fan of the eagles, ed rendell and alex wagner of msnbc's "now." governor, i want you to read what's going on here. first speaker boehner defended the gop's tax proposal saying it does take a bite out of the rich but president obama held firm to tax rate hike on the wealthiest. let's listen to the back and forth. >> revenues we're putting on the table are going to come from, guess who? the rich. there are ways to limit deductions, close loopholes and have the same people pay more of their money to the federal government without raising tax rates, which we believe will harm our economy. >> let's allow higher rates to go up for the top 2%, that includes all of you, yes. but not in any way that's going to affect your spending, your lifestyles, or the economy in any significant way. let's make sure that 98% of americans don't see it -- a single dime in tax
the fiscal cliff. the way republicans in congress and the president solved the debt ceiling crisis was to build this cliff, that we're now supposedly dangling off of. they invented this deadline we're up against. the debt ceiling fight was a disaster, and now republicans, surprise, want to have that fight again. "the new york times" reports that one idea bouncing around the right side of the aisle is this. the republicans will extend tax cuts for the middle class, and then when they need to raise the debt ceiling, quote, demand deep concessions on medicare and social security as a price to raise the debt ceiling. one republican senator reportedly called the debt ceiling the line in the stand. the odds are pretty close to zero that we mint a $1 trillion coin in order to pay off some of the debt. but there's striking movement in the direction of changing the rules so we don't ever have to fight over this completely unnecessary issue ever again. remember, this is important. the debt ceiling isn't about incurring future debt. it's about the money congress has already duly authorized an
view fooling around with the debt ceiling is worse than the fiscal cliff. so you're sort of trading one monster for another. i think it would be, again, absolutely nuts to go there. >> peter, what do you think? >> oh, i don't agree. i think that the fiscal cliff and it is a cliff, on january 1 withholding taxes go up to the tune of $400 billion. >> not necessarily. >> it would have a very negative effect on the economy. according to the legislation they would, jared. >> they would not. >> jared, you have to -- >> let me make a point. the treasury secretary can decide if he or she believes a deal sl imminent not to adjust withholding tables. very important. >> i'm talking about no deal and we go off the cliff. >> we go off and stay off. >> it's $400 billion. we have a lot of things to do with regard to our debt ceiling, and my feeling is no one really believes the united states of america is going to default on its debt even if it lapses. we're dealing with different things. one is real and substantive and the other is psychological. >> i really disagree. >> i know you do. >> we could ha
and decided to roll a debt ceiling extension in to the fiscal cliff deal whatever they end up striking here and seems to me acknowledging republicans have leverage with cpi and talking about raising the medicare age. my question to you as a progressive is, republicans want something big. is there any big concessions you can see acceptable? >> new york city i really can't. and the kind of things we are talking about, even if they're not -- may not be acceptable to me ever but talking about a version of the changed cpi, the president already said social security is off the table because it is not driving the deficit. that's kind of weird. changes to medicare eligibility again or changes to medicare payments or whatever, it's really complicated to negotiate but i have to say i agree with you, steve. i'm -- i wish that the president hadn't taken the 14th amendment off the table because we're all saying, well, nothing should be off the table. why is that off the table and even if it's tough thing to pull off in the long run? i think that this mania for a fiscal cliff deal is disturbing but i thi
prepared to go over the fiscal cliff? >> oh, absolutely. >> alan simpson co-chair of the president's debt commission, says both sides are making a high stakes gamble. >> when you have leaders of parties and people of the administration saying, i think it will be to the advantage of the democrats to go off the cliff, i think it will be advantage to the republicans to go off the cliff, or the president to go off the cliff, that's like betting your country. there's stupidity involved in that. >>> syria on the bring. secretary of state hillary clinton holds emergency talks with russia as u.s. officials confirm reports that the syrian military is prepared to launch chemical weapons against its own people. >> we've made it very clear what our position is with respect to chemical weapons and i think we will discuss that and many other aspects. >> the whole world is watching. the whole world is watching very closely. and the president of the united states has made very clear that there will be consequences. >> plus, sharp criticism from afghan president karzai. the exclusive nbc interview. why he
into a devastating recession. i mean, david said it well in his piece this morning. if you think the fiscal cliff is a problem, this kind of hostage taking around the debt ceiling is multiples of that and the president is, i think, very correct to stand extremely firm and be extremely clear that he's not going to play that game. >> karen, the politics of this are frightening for the republicans. the latest polling does not support their stance. and given that they spent four years obstructing this president and failed, why do it again from the outset of his second term? >> well, you know, there's good news for the republicans, martin. karl rove's group, crossroads gps is going to spend some money for some ads, and we know that's a successful strategy in convincing the american people. >> that's good news. >> i can't pass that chance up to do that. >> i understand. >> i think part of what's so important about the polling, we talked about this on monday and the quinnipiac polling you were showing, the republicans have had time to make their arguments and it's not working. more people are moving tow
. this is a product of what our negotiations were last year from the debt ceiling. how did we get to the fiscal cliff, it's not only the tax increase from the affordable care act that started january 1st, it happened in the last lame duck punted into this one and the last summer budget negotiation punted into this one. we'll get real cuts equal to what we're doing in debt ceiling increase and if we want to resolve that the best time is right now because we have another debt ceiling increase coming. >> you've told "the new york times" you think your party is boxed in. i want to read from "washington times" "republican leaders struggled tuesday to contain the backlash from conservatives of the gop's offer of $800 billion in tax increases to head off the fiscal cliff, a move that didn't impress the white house even as it spawned a rebellion on the right." so are republicans going to have to give on raising rates? >> no. we're not, because where the president is focused in on is the affordable care act taxes they increase january the 1st on people making $200,000 or more. the president wants a rate incre
the president can permit the economy to fall over the fiscal cliff, or curb, whatever you want to call it, he can't allow us to default on our debt. that would, like, destroy the economy. that gives republicans a stronger hand or so they think. but really, think about that. here's how it would go. later this month, republicans would, by voting present, which everyone would think was a bit weird, permit the bush tax cuts to expire for income over $250,000. that would let president obama pocket $1 trillion in tax revenue and secure a win on his key priority in the talks. but they would do nothing else. at the end of the year, we would still go over the fiscal cliff. remember, the bush tax cuts are one of the at least stimulative policies in the negotiations. according to the economic policy institute, extending the middle class tax cuts would wipe out only about 11% of the austerity's economic impact. 11%. but all that other stuff, the payroll tax cut, the unemployment insurance, the sequester, all that, that would still be expiring. so come early next year, the economy would likely be entering
over the fiscal cliff and then run into the debt limit in february. that would be a puriic victory. >> vus not goiit's just not goi happen. tell me, because you know these numbers better than anybody, other than people sitting in the white house that have looked at the very latest, but it seems like 37%. we're starting to hear that more, and both sides may coalesce around that eventually. let's say we change the rates to 35% and 37% and you eliminate deductions, not the home mortgage because we're not going to get that. we're probably not going to get charitable. can you say $1.2 trillion if that's where we compromise and new revenues. >> capital gains, dividends, estate. >> if you're more aggressive. >> about half theway. >> let's say you aggressively go on capital gains, dif evidends >> you start to get close. >> david ig nanatiuignatius, ar to have a deal? you know washington. >> my guess is we are going to have a deal just because the stars have now been in alignment. i've been struck by the way president obama has taken lead of his own party and himself been the negotiator, pu
the fiscal cliff. one element of this is are republicans going to be in this position, once again, to take the debt ceiling and the good faith and credit the u.s. hostage? president obama says we can't be in that position, again. and you are described, you, the press says, well, he said, listen. this is extraordinary. you ought to be talking about the damage caused by -- >> there's no doubt on this debt ceiling issue. look, this is part of the negotiations, this is in the middle of the, sort of the three tiered. they have a better chance of agreeing on taxes and entitlements than the debt ceiling. boehner who himself may agree, if we can't have this fight again because the business community will absolutely go crazy about it. he's got to bring back a political tool or some piece of victory. >> i would say, chuck, actually, the reporting now is better than it was a year ago. and some of what's happened is i think reporters have come to realize and many even republicans around that it's a party that went from being a conservative party to being a radical party and they're now struggling over
cliff. we know that the president wants more stimulus spending and increase in the debt limit without any cuts or reforms. that's not fixing our problem. frankly, it's making it worse. >> let me bring in our "news nation" political panel this hour. chris cafinus, michael smerkonish and louies romanis. what are we to make of speaker boehner coming out today, not sure of the overall message other than he wanted to have, i guess, a sound bite to play today as we continue to talk and the president is off at least negotiating behind the scenes on the fiscal cliff. >> i think you called it, tamron. look, the rhetoric is scaled back dramatically in the last few days. they're talking and seriously evidenced by the fact we're not learning that much. they're keeping it pretty close to the vest. i think the speaker is under enormous pressure of his own caucus to get something, to extract something in return for these tax hikes. and that's why he's talking about spending cuts. but i think that they're moving along on this process is my interpretation of it. >> as we understand it, both sides are
will not play that game. >> tonight, democratic whip steny hoyer gives me the latest fiscal cliff developments and the democratic line on medicare. tom perriello from the center of american progress action fund on how democrats can deal with republicans who can't deal with reality. rubio and ryan reload with a new message for the middle class. >> both parties tend to divide americans into our voters and their voters. >> but there is no escaping their own policies. >> we're going to a majority of takers versus makers in america. >> dnc chair debbie wasserman schultz responds tonight. plus, senator barbara boxer on her new plan for national polling place standards. and a new poll shows half of all republicans think the defunct group a.c.o.r.n. stole the election from president obama. >> that's an eye opener. >> i wonder where they ever got that idea? >> you just have to wait and see what happens. >>> good to have you with us tonight, folks. thanks for watching. here is are the latest. republicans are at a stalemate with the white house for debt negotiations. republicans really only have two opti
negotiations over the debt ceiling fell apart. to understand what's going on during the hopeless fiscal cliff negotiations rewind to 2011 when boehner and president obama came within inches of a grand bargain, a deal that would have forced both democrats and republicans to eat their vegetables. in its comprehensive analysis of what happens during the secret negotiations, matt bai wrote -- the deal unraveled in large part because speaker boehner could not get his unruly caucus to go along with raising new revenue. fast forward to this year and republicans now think that deal, the one they walked away from, sounds pretty good. they're using it as a basis for their current proposal. only problem. boehner had his chance. president obama now thinks he has the upper hand. according to the "washington post's" ezra klein, quote -- >> joining us now representative chris van hollen of maryland, ranking member of the house budget committee. great to have you on the program. >> great to be with you, alex. >> let's talk a little bit about 2011 versus 2012, which is to say, the republican party is a very d
fiasco surrounding the fiscal cliff. stay with us. but they haven't experienced extra strength bayer advanced aspirin. in fact, in a recent survey, 95% of people who tried it agreed that it relieved their headache fast. visit fastreliefchallenge.com today for a special trial offer. the distances aren't getting shorter. ♪ the trucks are going farther. the new 2013 ram 1500. ♪ with the best-in-class fuel economy. engineered to move heaven and earth. ♪ guts. glory. ram. >>> president obama is taking his fiscal cliff plan to the people. will republicans buckle under public pressure? msnbc's political analyst michael eric dyson and democratic strategist donna genteel-o'donnell will weigh in on that tonight. >>> the ceo of apple makes a big announcement about the future of the company's products. e.j. dionne on the political impact of that later. we'll be right back. oh, cloudy glasses. you didn't have to come over! actually, honey, i think i did... oh? you did? whoa, ladies, easy. hi. cascade kitchen counselor. we can help avoid this with cascade complete pacs. see, over time, casca
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fiasco surrounding the fiscal cliff. >>> president obama is taking his fiscal cliff plan to the people. will republicans buckle under public pressure? msnbc's political analyst michael eric dyson and democratic strategist donna gentile-o'donnell will weigh in on that tonight. >>> welcome back to "the ed show." president obama has put house speaker john boehner and republicans in a box on fiscal cliff negotiations. and the evidence is mounting. president obama stayed on offense today, visiting the santana family in northern virginia whose taxes will go up more than $4,000 in 2013 if middle class tax cuts aren't extended. >> i'm encouraged to see that there's been some discussion on the part of republicans acknowledging the need for additional revenue. as i've indicated, the only way to get the kind of revenue for a balanced deficit reduction plan is to make sure that we're also modestly increasing rates for people who can afford it. folks like me. just to be clear, i'm not going to sign any package that somehow prevents the top rate from going up for folks at the top 2%. >> the concerte
it up into smaller bills. in a sense what we are talking about with the fiscal cliff where there may be a deal on tax rates and later next year deal with entitlements in the deficits and debt ceiling and the other issues facing us. would you support backing away from a comprehensive legislation to perhaps piece meal it together or are we past that at this point with so many millions of people in the country illegally? >> there is a consensus growing that piece meal doesn't work. every time we had an individual element of the comprehensive immigration reform and taken one piece and putting it on the floor, it becomes where everybody else wants to add on. if you put ag jobs on the floor for the agriculture industry, the high tech industry said wait a minute, we need visas for high tech workers. site food industry said we need the low visas for ship hands. then you have the hotel and restaurant industry. you have a series of elements that become a demand. you are back to trying to solve the problem comprehensively. there is a agreeing consensus that we have to achieve through comprehens
the unemployment and that's got to be part of the fiscal cliff negotiations that. is something that the republicans have to deal with. and i think the republicans and making sure that the debt ceiling is extended for a long time because the one thing that could hurt the economy even more than going off some curb or cliff or slope is if we had a rep tilgs of the debt ceiling battle that we had in 2011. >> so in your view right now, you think that we're past -- potentially past the tax reform question? it's about not the stimulus money but the debt ceiling negotiation and it's important because many communities are not impacted by private sector job growth and need the public sector jobs that the stimulus would bring. >> yes. i think that, you know, you can't declare something done until it's done. but i think all of the signals you're getting from the republicans is that they realize that the last thing they need to be doing right now is to look like they are holding up middle class tax cuts to protect tax cuts for the very wealthy. that's not where they want to be and somewhere deep inside they kno
the analysis of the fiscal cliff impact was too rosy? >> projections are very difficult. it's very difficult to take into account the effect on confidence. as i said, consumers have been confident. they've maintained that confidence. but look at what happened during the debt limit debacle a year ago august. look at how the economy came to a grinding halt at that point. >> and that's your fear that the cliff could just freeze consume earp confidence and that's something you can't right now project as an economist? >> no one wants to go over the fiscal cliff. worse would be for the president to sign a bad bill. >> all right. alan krueger, chairman of the president's counscil on economi advisers. mr. krueger, nice to see you that month. i'll see you next month, i promise. >> thank you, chuck. >>> trivia time, jim demint's decision to step down 0 means south carolina will have two seats on the ballot in 2014. who was elected the last time both of south carolina's senate seats were on the ballot in the same election? strom thurmond, of course, and the longest serving junior senator perhaps in the
characterized this fight over the fiscal cliff but alan simpson managed to do it with a video promoting had is campaign to fix the debt. >> stop instagramming your breakfast and tweeting your problems and getting on youtube so you can see gangnam style. ♪ and start using those precious social media skills to go out and sign people up on this baby, three people a week, let it grow, and don't forget take part or get taken apart. by these old ones will clean out the treasury before you get there. ♪ >> [ inaudible ]. >> the lasso again and then the horseback. horse horse. the cowboys ride. >> it made my day. i had to share it with you. chris cizilla an msnbc contributor and managing editor of post politics.com and susan page, washington bureau chief for "usa today." hello. alan simpson never fails. >> i was instagraming, andrea. i was busy instagraming. >> chris, maybe this do broke through. put him on the road, have him go door to door. >> my favorite part of the video which i have watched approximately 1,000 times is when he says at the end, so another lasso then. >> and he is a man who k
, but at the very least i think we would avoid big pieces of the fiscal cliff. thanks for joining us today. >> good to be with you. >> what will come from the closed door meeting between the president and speaker pain every wresh we'll talk with bill daley, former chief of staff for president obama. >>> an historic day for girls day worldwide. in honor of malala, the pakistani teen shot by the taliban. this is andrea mitchell on msnbc. sniffs ] i have a cold. [ sniffs ] i took dayquil but my nose is still runny. [ male announcer ] truth is, dayquil doesn't treat that. really? [ male announcer ] alka-seltzer plus fights your worst cold symptoms, plus it relieves your runny nose. [ breathes deeply ] awesome. [ male announcer ] yes, it is. that's the cold truth! social security are just numbers thinkin a budget.d... well, we worked hard for those benefits. we earned them. and if washington tries to cram decisions about the future... of these programs into a last minute budget deal... we'll all pay the price. aarp is fighting to protect seniors with responsible... solutions that strengthen medicare and
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